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	<title>Comments on: Report from the Presbyterian General Assembly &#8211; Part 2, The Jewish Response</title>
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		<title>By: James Marino</title>
		<link>http://markbraverman.org/2010/07/report-from-the-presbyterian-general-assembly-part-2-the-jewish-response/comment-page-1/#comment-664</link>
		<dc:creator>James Marino</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Aug 2010 15:24:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://markbraverman.org/?p=529#comment-664</guid>
		<description>Mr. Braverman,
I had the distinct pleasure of being present in an audience when you were an invited speaker in Teaneck, New Jersey.  I brought with me my &quot;second Mother&quot;, a secular Jew who is a good soul in all regards and a staunch supporter of Israel (all her 90+ years of life).  Although dismayed by the representations of Israeli indifference and violation of Palestinian human rights, she has been unable to reconcile this relatively new perception with her life long belief in the moral integrity of the jewish people and her suspicion for Israeli&#039;s traditional &quot;enemies&quot; [sic].  When I last spoke to her about reconciliation betrween Arbs and Jews in the Middle East, she seemed to &quot;throw up her hands&quot; in a fatalistic comment and jesture, that &quot;they&quot; (the enemies of Israel) would never live in peace with the Jews.  It is her heart and mind that your message should speak to and I will pass your thoughtful comments on for her consideration.

Jim</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Braverman,<br />
I had the distinct pleasure of being present in an audience when you were an invited speaker in Teaneck, New Jersey.  I brought with me my &#8220;second Mother&#8221;, a secular Jew who is a good soul in all regards and a staunch supporter of Israel (all her 90+ years of life).  Although dismayed by the representations of Israeli indifference and violation of Palestinian human rights, she has been unable to reconcile this relatively new perception with her life long belief in the moral integrity of the jewish people and her suspicion for Israeli&#8217;s traditional &#8220;enemies&#8221; [sic].  When I last spoke to her about reconciliation betrween Arbs and Jews in the Middle East, she seemed to &#8220;throw up her hands&#8221; in a fatalistic comment and jesture, that &#8220;they&#8221; (the enemies of Israel) would never live in peace with the Jews.  It is her heart and mind that your message should speak to and I will pass your thoughtful comments on for her consideration.</p>
<p>Jim</p>
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		<title>By: DAY OF JOY IN OCCUPIED PALESTINE &#124; My Catbird Seat</title>
		<link>http://markbraverman.org/2010/07/report-from-the-presbyterian-general-assembly-part-2-the-jewish-response/comment-page-1/#comment-647</link>
		<dc:creator>DAY OF JOY IN OCCUPIED PALESTINE &#124; My Catbird Seat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Jul 2010 06:34:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://markbraverman.org/?p=529#comment-647</guid>
		<description>[...] Mark Braverman’s report on the victory at the Presbyterian Assembly and lays out the nature of the Zionist tactics to thwart Christian action for peace and justice [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Mark Braverman’s report on the victory at the Presbyterian Assembly and lays out the nature of the Zionist tactics to thwart Christian action for peace and justice [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Braverman</title>
		<link>http://markbraverman.org/2010/07/report-from-the-presbyterian-general-assembly-part-2-the-jewish-response/comment-page-1/#comment-645</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Braverman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 19:55:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://markbraverman.org/?p=529#comment-645</guid>
		<description>Chris,

Renouncing supersessionism, or &quot;replacement theology&quot; as it is more usefully often called, became &quot;the Christian sin&quot; after the wake-up call of the Nazi holocaust.  Penitence for anti-Semitism has dominated institutional and doctrinal Christianity in the mainstream since then. So it&#039;s been easy to pick it up as a club to wield in the debate to shut down criticism of Israel.  But it&#039;s disingenuous and a lie -- not because criticism of Israel is anti-Semitic or supersessionist -- it isn&#039;t -- but because it&#039;s an easy out for Christians.  You&#039;re right:  some evangelical Christian Zionists (important qualification - increasing numbers of evangelicals are supporting the justice for Palestine cause because they&#039;ve been there and seen what is going on, and they are working out the theology) are supersessionists, or what I would call Christian exceptionalists or triumphalists. What is fascinating about this is if you look at it, you see that the mainstream, &quot;progressive&quot; Zionism is a form of supersessionism.  The people who accuse other Christians of implicit anti-Semitism because they are critical of Israel are practicing a form of Christian triumphalism. What Christians needed to confront when they confronted Auschwitz was what was it about Christianity that could have brought this about, how did this poisonous doctrine come about, and why did Christians support it institutionally.  Instead they decided to reinstate Jews as God&#039;s chosen, un-spiritualize the land promise and offer Palestine to the Jews as a guilt offering, and then hitch a ride on the Jews&#039; new status in a kind of Judeo-Christian triumphalism.  In this theology (and this is what three generations of clergy have been schooled in), of course the Palestinians don&#039;t count. Muslims -- heck, anybody not Jewish or Christian -- don&#039;t count (except to be economically colonized through charity).  

Yes, it&#039;s politics.  And it&#039;s also driven by what I would call -- with apologies to Bonhoeffer -- cheap penitence.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris,</p>
<p>Renouncing supersessionism, or &#8220;replacement theology&#8221; as it is more usefully often called, became &#8220;the Christian sin&#8221; after the wake-up call of the Nazi holocaust.  Penitence for anti-Semitism has dominated institutional and doctrinal Christianity in the mainstream since then. So it&#8217;s been easy to pick it up as a club to wield in the debate to shut down criticism of Israel.  But it&#8217;s disingenuous and a lie &#8212; not because criticism of Israel is anti-Semitic or supersessionist &#8212; it isn&#8217;t &#8212; but because it&#8217;s an easy out for Christians.  You&#8217;re right:  some evangelical Christian Zionists (important qualification &#8211; increasing numbers of evangelicals are supporting the justice for Palestine cause because they&#8217;ve been there and seen what is going on, and they are working out the theology) are supersessionists, or what I would call Christian exceptionalists or triumphalists. What is fascinating about this is if you look at it, you see that the mainstream, &#8220;progressive&#8221; Zionism is a form of supersessionism.  The people who accuse other Christians of implicit anti-Semitism because they are critical of Israel are practicing a form of Christian triumphalism. What Christians needed to confront when they confronted Auschwitz was what was it about Christianity that could have brought this about, how did this poisonous doctrine come about, and why did Christians support it institutionally.  Instead they decided to reinstate Jews as God&#8217;s chosen, un-spiritualize the land promise and offer Palestine to the Jews as a guilt offering, and then hitch a ride on the Jews&#8217; new status in a kind of Judeo-Christian triumphalism.  In this theology (and this is what three generations of clergy have been schooled in), of course the Palestinians don&#8217;t count. Muslims &#8212; heck, anybody not Jewish or Christian &#8212; don&#8217;t count (except to be economically colonized through charity).  </p>
<p>Yes, it&#8217;s politics.  And it&#8217;s also driven by what I would call &#8212; with apologies to Bonhoeffer &#8212; cheap penitence.</p>
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		<title>By: Bill Plitt</title>
		<link>http://markbraverman.org/2010/07/report-from-the-presbyterian-general-assembly-part-2-the-jewish-response/comment-page-1/#comment-644</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill Plitt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 16:06:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://markbraverman.org/?p=529#comment-644</guid>
		<description>Hi Mark,

As our Quaker friend often says, &quot;This friend speaks my mind&quot;.  What you capture in your blog is a nice crystalization, and distillation of both the events leading  up to the General Assembly and what occurred during the meeting days.  And more, you speak of next steps and partnerships.   As a Presbyterian who traveled to General Assembly and got caught up in the flurry of actions, I needed some clarity about what occurred and the implications for what had happened.  You greatly contributed, as always, a sense of the &quot;wind&quot;.    Thanks for that gift.  Bill</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Mark,</p>
<p>As our Quaker friend often says, &#8220;This friend speaks my mind&#8221;.  What you capture in your blog is a nice crystalization, and distillation of both the events leading  up to the General Assembly and what occurred during the meeting days.  And more, you speak of next steps and partnerships.   As a Presbyterian who traveled to General Assembly and got caught up in the flurry of actions, I needed some clarity about what occurred and the implications for what had happened.  You greatly contributed, as always, a sense of the &#8220;wind&#8221;.    Thanks for that gift.  Bill</p>
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		<title>By: Ned Castner</title>
		<link>http://markbraverman.org/2010/07/report-from-the-presbyterian-general-assembly-part-2-the-jewish-response/comment-page-1/#comment-643</link>
		<dc:creator>Ned Castner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 12:00:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://markbraverman.org/?p=529#comment-643</guid>
		<description>My wife and I were privileged to hear Mark Braverman and Jeff Halper speak at Tree of Life conferences in Old Lyme, CT. We are thankful that they were able to be present at the recent General Assembly. We appreciate Mark&#039;s thoughtful, caring and fair report.  Ned Castner</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My wife and I were privileged to hear Mark Braverman and Jeff Halper speak at Tree of Life conferences in Old Lyme, CT. We are thankful that they were able to be present at the recent General Assembly. We appreciate Mark&#8217;s thoughtful, caring and fair report.  Ned Castner</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Braverman</title>
		<link>http://markbraverman.org/2010/07/report-from-the-presbyterian-general-assembly-part-2-the-jewish-response/comment-page-1/#comment-620</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Braverman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 08:45:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://markbraverman.org/?p=529#comment-620</guid>
		<description>Thank you, Jim.  My sense (hope?) is that what we saw in MSP is the leading edge.  What&#039;s interesting is that for the PCUSA, much does seem to get played out at the denominational level.  With the ELCA as with the other major denominations, the actions at that level are much more careful. But we need to keep our eye on the grassroots -- and remember that the overtures to the PCUSA GA all originated from Presbyteries, and got their support and momentum from individuals -- clergy and laity -- at that local, grassroots level. I was deeply impressed by what we saw in Dubuque, for example at that last luncheon where members of the community -- local clergy, academics, students, seminary faculty, community activists -- came together to talk about what could be done at the community level to advance the cause through education, activism (e.g. BDS). We need to keep our eye on the grassroots -- and remember that the overtures to the PCUSA GA all originated from Presbyteries, and got their support and momentum from individuals -- clergy and laity -- at that local, grassroots level.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you, Jim.  My sense (hope?) is that what we saw in MSP is the leading edge.  What&#8217;s interesting is that for the PCUSA, much does seem to get played out at the denominational level.  With the ELCA as with the other major denominations, the actions at that level are much more careful. But we need to keep our eye on the grassroots &#8212; and remember that the overtures to the PCUSA GA all originated from Presbyteries, and got their support and momentum from individuals &#8212; clergy and laity &#8212; at that local, grassroots level. I was deeply impressed by what we saw in Dubuque, for example at that last luncheon where members of the community &#8212; local clergy, academics, students, seminary faculty, community activists &#8212; came together to talk about what could be done at the community level to advance the cause through education, activism (e.g. BDS). We need to keep our eye on the grassroots &#8212; and remember that the overtures to the PCUSA GA all originated from Presbyteries, and got their support and momentum from individuals &#8212; clergy and laity &#8212; at that local, grassroots level.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Lowe</title>
		<link>http://markbraverman.org/2010/07/report-from-the-presbyterian-general-assembly-part-2-the-jewish-response/comment-page-1/#comment-618</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Lowe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 03:30:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://markbraverman.org/?p=529#comment-618</guid>
		<description>Mark,

This may not be the best place to pose this question, and perhaps not even you the best to answer it, but I have been reading about Presbyterian events as an outsider with interest and am particularly intrigued by the invocation of supersessionist theology as a particular form of anti-Semitism in the debates.  The question that keeps coming to my mind is to wonder if I am wrong in thinking that in fact the theological position of a great many Evangelical and Pentecostal &quot;Christian Zionists&quot; is supersessionist -- that certainly would be my impression.  Which further makes me wonder if the theologians who raise this issue in their readings or misreadings of those they see as critics of Israel do the same regarding supersessionism on the part of Christian Zionist &quot;friends of Israel.&quot;  If they do not, it would seem to indicate that the real interest is not theological at the end of the day, but to do with worldly politics.  

Thanks for considering this -- any help from you or other readers to sources of insight about this question gratefully accepted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark,</p>
<p>This may not be the best place to pose this question, and perhaps not even you the best to answer it, but I have been reading about Presbyterian events as an outsider with interest and am particularly intrigued by the invocation of supersessionist theology as a particular form of anti-Semitism in the debates.  The question that keeps coming to my mind is to wonder if I am wrong in thinking that in fact the theological position of a great many Evangelical and Pentecostal &#8220;Christian Zionists&#8221; is supersessionist &#8212; that certainly would be my impression.  Which further makes me wonder if the theologians who raise this issue in their readings or misreadings of those they see as critics of Israel do the same regarding supersessionism on the part of Christian Zionist &#8220;friends of Israel.&#8221;  If they do not, it would seem to indicate that the real interest is not theological at the end of the day, but to do with worldly politics.  </p>
<p>Thanks for considering this &#8212; any help from you or other readers to sources of insight about this question gratefully accepted.</p>
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		<title>By: James L. Bailey</title>
		<link>http://markbraverman.org/2010/07/report-from-the-presbyterian-general-assembly-part-2-the-jewish-response/comment-page-1/#comment-617</link>
		<dc:creator>James L. Bailey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 17:37:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://markbraverman.org/?p=529#comment-617</guid>
		<description>Hi Mark,

Thanks for the update on the action at the General Assembly of PCUSA.  What you describe is encouraging.  That when a church takes a stand on justice, then others have to adjust their rhetoric.  The action of the Presbyterians might strengthen the resolve of other national churches, including the Lutherans.

Your blogs are thoughtful and honest.   

With good memories of your time with us at Wartburg Seminary,

Jim Bailey</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Mark,</p>
<p>Thanks for the update on the action at the General Assembly of PCUSA.  What you describe is encouraging.  That when a church takes a stand on justice, then others have to adjust their rhetoric.  The action of the Presbyterians might strengthen the resolve of other national churches, including the Lutherans.</p>
<p>Your blogs are thoughtful and honest.   </p>
<p>With good memories of your time with us at Wartburg Seminary,</p>
<p>Jim Bailey</p>
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		<title>By: Barry</title>
		<link>http://markbraverman.org/2010/07/report-from-the-presbyterian-general-assembly-part-2-the-jewish-response/comment-page-1/#comment-616</link>
		<dc:creator>Barry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 13:14:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://markbraverman.org/?p=529#comment-616</guid>
		<description>Dear Mark,

Thank you for the account of the dynamics at Minneapolis (and your book). Here is at least one Canadian Presbyterian following developments in the PCUSA with great interest and appreciation. I am sure there are lots of others.  

Our Assembly this year also included representatives from both the Palestinian Christian community and the Canadian Jewish Congress - although the emphasis of the document under discussion (&quot;One Covenant of Grace&quot; www.presbyterian.ca/webfm_send/5040) from the Church Doctrine committee was historical and theological rather than directly addressing the situation on the ground. Maybe next year. 

Blessings and Shalom. 

Barry</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Mark,</p>
<p>Thank you for the account of the dynamics at Minneapolis (and your book). Here is at least one Canadian Presbyterian following developments in the PCUSA with great interest and appreciation. I am sure there are lots of others.  </p>
<p>Our Assembly this year also included representatives from both the Palestinian Christian community and the Canadian Jewish Congress &#8211; although the emphasis of the document under discussion (&#8220;One Covenant of Grace&#8221; <a href="http://www.presbyterian.ca/webfm_send/5040">http://www.presbyterian.ca/webfm_send/5040</a>) from the Church Doctrine committee was historical and theological rather than directly addressing the situation on the ground. Maybe next year. </p>
<p>Blessings and Shalom. </p>
<p>Barry</p>
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		<title>By: Carolyn Harris</title>
		<link>http://markbraverman.org/2010/07/report-from-the-presbyterian-general-assembly-part-2-the-jewish-response/comment-page-1/#comment-615</link>
		<dc:creator>Carolyn Harris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 05:15:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://markbraverman.org/?p=529#comment-615</guid>
		<description>Hi Mark:

      It is such a delight to read your analysis of what went on at GA concerning the MESC Report &quot;Breaaking Down the Walls&quot;.  Your perspective is so accurate and so hopeful.  We have our Presbytery meeting in 4 days and I plan to make use of it when I talk to people there.  I want to thank you again for being part of our work to make sure that the Report as adopted was faithful to the intent of the Committee and for all of us who are working for peace and justice in Israel/Palestine.

Carolyn</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Mark:</p>
<p>      It is such a delight to read your analysis of what went on at GA concerning the MESC Report &#8220;Breaaking Down the Walls&#8221;.  Your perspective is so accurate and so hopeful.  We have our Presbytery meeting in 4 days and I plan to make use of it when I talk to people there.  I want to thank you again for being part of our work to make sure that the Report as adopted was faithful to the intent of the Committee and for all of us who are working for peace and justice in Israel/Palestine.</p>
<p>Carolyn</p>
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